Curse

Ninna · Jun 02, 2005, 08:23 PM // 20:23

you certainly have more variety to choose from if have all skills
(with expansions, im assuming a player will have access to 300+ skills)

but in the end,
- you can only carry *8 skills* with you into combat
- you can only carry *one* elite skill

Dumachum · Jun 02, 2005, 08:25 PM // 20:25

Quote:

Originally Posted by gwden

The argument here is that they already did the missions, did the quests, and now they want to PvP, but they can't pvp competitively without the right skills. As a result, they're forced REPEAT the whole process. This is a problem because most of these "pricks" were under the impression that this game is "skill over time" when they bought it.

Only YOU DONT need 80 elites and 20 superior runes unlocked to be competetive. And if you DO then chances are you won't beat the ones who don't when they DO end up getting them. Your argument is retarded and without base.

Or hey how about we give the whiners their own ladder but limit them to nothing but template builds. 8 skills, no runes, no elites. INSTANT EQUALITY EXACTLY WHAT THEY ARE WHINING FOR. Then the only way to get an edge would exploiting spell bugs and mechanics to rack up 50 straight wins (which some of the "elite" already seem to be gods at) How does that idea sound?

Counter Strike is THAT way ---->

AirOnG · Jun 02, 2005, 08:26 PM // 20:26

Quote:

Originally Posted by WeiPing

Sure....all things being equal, it's better to have a 5% advantage than it is to not have a 5% advantage. I don't argue that. And for people who take this game extremely seroiusly, it definitely makes sense to get that 5% advantage.

None of that has any effect on my argument, which is, you do not need that 5% in order to be competative.

This would depend on your connotation of "competitive." Most alpha players and beta players agree runes (specially superior) offer a significant advantage to those who have them over those who don't. You have to understand that things like 5% more damage or healing in a game such as this translates into much more than a 5% advantage if you take into account a variety of other factors.

Dumachan, you shouldn't demonize the opposition simply because it is convenient for your perspective. They are reasonable humans much as yourself. Calling them pricks is simply childish.

Flexibility of builds helps, Ninna, in both experimentation and countering your opponent between battles.

Ninna · Jun 02, 2005, 08:30 PM // 20:30

I agree that it helps with flexibilility

I'm disagreeing you are "not competitive" if you don't have all skills possible

Dumachum · Jun 02, 2005, 08:31 PM // 20:31

I have NEVER met a reasonable "pvper/pk". Nice try.

gwden · Jun 02, 2005, 08:36 PM // 20:36

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ninna

you certainly have more variety to choose from if have all skills
(with expansions, im assuming a player will have access to 300+ skills)

but in the end,
- you can only carry *8 skills* with you into combat
- you can only carry *one* elite skill

Actually, in the end it's 64 skills, 8 for each member of the group. That's 8 elite skills. Don't forget, we're talking about competitive PvP and not some random arena clusterf.

64 skills is nothing to laugh at. Don't forget that guilds try different strategies before they go into the arena. If someone is dominating HoH with a specific build and you lose to them, you'd change the strategy and skills, and go back in. As you can see, you need all skills available at any give time.

Ninna · Jun 02, 2005, 08:40 PM // 20:40

Guild Wars is the most class balanced fantasy MMO I have ever played

I have faith in Anet that when they make this claim, they will probably deliver
http://www.guildwars.com/faq/default.html#release

Quote:

When you buy the chapters of Guild Wars, you will acquire a larger collection of skills and abilities from which to build your skill set, but you will not gain more power. So if you purchase a chapter and your friend does not, you will still be able to play competitively against and with one another.

before you challenge any other Anet claims
- please post Anet quotes with llinks

nechronius · Jun 02, 2005, 08:41 PM // 20:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ninna

according to your logic

you *MUST* buy all future expansions (with new skills) to remain competitive

the PvP game is fasioned after the card game Magic: The Gathering

- you dont need all skills to be competitive

MTG is a poor example. I'll spare readers the page of explanation as to why this is the case, but it is. The basic gameplay idea may be similar, but the implementation is where the real difference is.

Dumachum · Jun 02, 2005, 08:45 PM // 20:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ninna

Guild Wars is the most class balanced fantasy MMO I have ever played

I have faith in Anet that when they make this claim, they will probably deliver
http://www.guildwars.com/faq/default.html#release

before you challenge any other Anet claims
- please post Anet quotes with llinks

You call people bringing 4-5 Air elementals and Mo/Me's into tomb "class ballanced"?

Ninna · Jun 02, 2005, 08:46 PM // 20:46

Quote:

Originally Posted by nechronius

MTG is a poor example. I'll spare readers the page of explanation as to why this is the case, but it is. The basic gameplay idea may be similar, but the implementation is where the real difference is.

it may be a poor example but thats what Anet has compared Guild Wars PvP to

from same link
http://www.guildwars.com/faq/default.html#release

Quote:

Purchasing the newer chapters of Guild Wars will not make you strictly more powerful. You will have access to many more strategic options, due to the expanding nature of the skills, abilities, items and professions that you enjoy with each chapter.

It would be similar to building a deck in Magic: The Gathering™: The more cards you own, the more different playing decks that you can choose from to use in the game.

WeiPing · Jun 02, 2005, 08:51 PM // 20:51

Laughable at best.

gwden · Jun 02, 2005, 08:54 PM // 20:54

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ninna

Guild Wars is the most class balanced fantasy MMO I have ever played

I have faith in Anet that when they make this claim, they will probably deliver
http://www.guildwars.com/faq/default.html#release

before you challenge any other Anet claims
- please post Anet quotes with llinks

First of all, GW is not a MMO. It is actually:

Quote:

Rather than labeling Guild Wars an MMORPG, we prefer to call it a CORPG (Competitive Online Role-Playing Game). Guild Wars was designed from the ground up to create the best possible competitive role-playing experience. Success in Guild Wars is always the result of player skill, not time spent playing or the size of one's guild.

Second of all, all companies claim their expansions will not make people more competitive, but in the end, they do. One popular expample of this is DAoC and their ToA expansion. The only way they make that happen is by separating people like Blizzard did with Diablo 2.

Ninna · Jun 02, 2005, 08:57 PM // 20:57

I hope you are wrong about needing all future expansions to compete in PvP

time will tell

Icarium · Jun 02, 2005, 08:59 PM // 20:59

Quote:

Originally Posted by Volarian

It's funny that soooo many people expose themselves as LAZY

"PvP'rs have to grind"....well boo freaking hoo, if you want instant gratification go play a PS2 or Xbox and get cheat codes before you buy a game so that you can circumvent the primary theme of the game.....which is PLAYING IT.

I think all of the threads like this one, which start out as a player showing how they've LEARNED skill combo's that allow them to handle larger mobs alone, then have someone piping up their personal greivance with regards to PvE vs PvP are absolutely depressing.
If you don't like it, don't play and definitely don't post in ANY thread about your displeasure because you actually have to EARN something that you want. Go back to playing DOOM or Duke Nukem with GOD MODE...if you don't want to enjoy the graphics and gameplay GW offers....cause we don't wanna hear it!!!

could not have said it better myself , and this would apply to amlost every thread ive posted in

gwden · Jun 02, 2005, 09:00 PM // 21:00

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ninna

I hope you are wrong about needing all future expansions to compete in PvP

time will tell

Think about it, you have 450 skills and the guy you're fighting with has 750. Out of those new 300 skills, I'm betting many will be counters to old skill set.

Ninna · Jun 02, 2005, 09:01 PM // 21:01

MMO is not MMORPG

MMO is a generic term and encompassing of many styles of online play

Diablo and Diablo2 are MMOs

EQ/AO/WOW are MMORPGS (and loosely MMO)

Guild Wars is CORPG (and loosely MMO)

Studio Ghibli · Jun 02, 2005, 10:13 PM // 22:13

Wow.

Talk about derailed.

For what it's worth, superior and major runes do offer a nice advantage in that you're able to ration your skill points more effectively.

Garric · Jun 02, 2005, 10:20 PM // 22:20

I can't believe people even think farming takes skill. This is how you farm:

Go online, to forums. Find a post or guide saying:

"omg dud u can farm deze guys for major lootage, omg u noob, look at dis video. i ownd deze guys the ran up to me and i ownd em by using these skillz:

1. skill x
2. skill y ..
8. skill z.

now u can do it too u nub, farm liek ever1 else it takes mad skillz~!!!!"

evilb · Jun 02, 2005, 10:23 PM // 22:23

why are people so hang up on "They Don't Drop Armor" so "It's not worth to farm there".

If I want to farm armor so badly all i need is to go to x location and farm there.

guess what, you can also unlock weapon upgrades not just runes(armor). From staff wrappings to sword upgrades.

and some people are also farming for gold. So they can buy unlocked items.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Garric

I can't believe people even think farming takes skill. This is how you farm:

Go online, to forums. Find a post or guide saying:

"omg dud u can farm deze guys for major lootage, omg u noob, look at dis video. i ownd deze guys the ran up to me and i ownd em by using these skillz:

1. skill x
2. skill y ..
8. skill z.

now u can do it too u nub, farm liek ever1 else it takes mad skillz~!!!!"

You should note that making heavy use of protective spirit and superior runes rocks.

such concept isn't only applied to farming but also playing in general.

vs. Air Elementalists in PVP?

stumpy · Jun 03, 2005, 11:05 PM // 23:05

you wont NEED them ... persay... they will include bonus stuff that will not directly effect people playing together nor will it effect peiple playing against one another.

It will just open up more options to those who do buy it however it is not necessary. If you find a good build with this test it out after ... you may not need the 300 skills, if your still owning people.